I know there are people on here who will disagree with me when I say that there is absolutely NO use for a round hole on a Martin cavity any longer. Disagree if you like, my stance on this subject will not change.
I hear people say that there aren't many Starlings around their area, their Martins can't enter SREH's, they trap and shoot all Starlings at their site, etc.... These in my opinion are only poor excuses for a very serious problem. How many people here have Martin poles with no predator guards? If you saw snakes in your yard, say one a month, would you not put a predator guard on your pole? There are people on this forum who see Starlings every day that don't have SREH on their nesting cavities. Do these people think they can shoot every Starling that flies within 100 feet of their poles? Are you there with gun in hand from before daylight until after dark, and a crack shot so as to never miss a Starling when shooting at it? How long does it take a Starling to slip in amongst Martins and claim a cavity? It takes only a few seconds.
When I started with this hobby I had 3 entrance hole choices. Round, Crescent, and Obround. Round holes of course offer no Starling help. Obrounds are about 50% Starling resistant after a year or two, and crescents are fairly hard for Martins to learn to enter from my personaly experience with them.
There are now several easily navigated SREH Martin entrances available to us as landlords. Two of the best IMO, are the WDC and Excluder II. I have all WDC's at my site. I know several others with EX II's. I have never seen a Martin hesitate or struggle to enter one of my WDC's. ASY, SY, or HY. There is not a Starling PROOF entrance hole on the market. Having said that, my gourds have been all WDC's since the year they were publically known about. (2004?) I have NEVER had a Starling enter one at my site. We live on a farm and probably have 50 to 100 nesting pairs of Starlings here. They nest everywhere. I shoot them all the time. Every time I shoot one, two more show up. They try, and fail every year to enter my gourds.
There was not a SREH within many miles of here when I started this colony. I started with all Obrounds and Crescents. I got 4 pair my first year, 33 the second, 60 something the 3rd, over 100 the 4th. That's a pretty good growth rate for an area not saturated with Martin colonies or on a flyway.
If I was a betting man, I would be willing to bet that there is not a Martin nesting in the US or Canada that CAN NOT enter a WDC entrance, or any of the 2nd Generation SREH's.
So, at the risk of sound obnoxious (which I promise is not what I mean to do) why are some of you still using round holes?
Why are round entrance holes still in use?
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Donnie Hurdt MN
- Posts: 1723
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 11:14 pm
- Location: North Prairie, MN
You can lead a horse to water, but you cant make him drink. As long as there are martin houses there will be round holes like it or not. I dont think a martin know or cares what style of entrance is on the compartment it chooses as long as it feels that the nest area is safe.
I have a mixture of sreh and round entrances on my gourds at my neighbors coloneys and they have all WDC entrances on their housing I see no preferance by the martins over any one.
So, to answer your question I see no reason to convert any of my round holed gourds to sreh but on the other hand I will not buy another round holed gourd or put a round holed entrance on any gourd that I grow myself.
I have a mixture of sreh and round entrances on my gourds at my neighbors coloneys and they have all WDC entrances on their housing I see no preferance by the martins over any one.
So, to answer your question I see no reason to convert any of my round holed gourds to sreh but on the other hand I will not buy another round holed gourd or put a round holed entrance on any gourd that I grow myself.
PMCA member and Martin fanatic....
2011 A pair of subbies fledged three young but none returned in 2012
2015 One Pair of subbies came and stayed a few nits but got chased away by Bluebirds and Tree swallows.
2017 0ne pair of subbies nested and fledged 4 young
2018 Tree Swallows AGAIN chased away any martins that wanted to nest
2019 Same old story................
2011 A pair of subbies fledged three young but none returned in 2012
2015 One Pair of subbies came and stayed a few nits but got chased away by Bluebirds and Tree swallows.
2017 0ne pair of subbies nested and fledged 4 young
2018 Tree Swallows AGAIN chased away any martins that wanted to nest
2019 Same old story................
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Steve Kroenke
- Posts: 4342
- Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:49 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Logansport
We live in a free country, with personal choice and folks can make their OWN minds up regarding what is best for their purple martin colonies. I use round holes and I am not a slumlord, I am not inferior, and I am not stupid. I can make independent decisions and don't "follow the herd".
There is absolutely nothing wrong with using round holes if you don't have a starling problem or you can control it. We have a minor starling problem around our two personal martin colonies and I easily control it with shooting/trapping. I shot a whopping 3 starlings this season and none even landed on our martin housing.
The martins in our two colonies prefer round holes, are never entrapped in them, and the martin can easily enter/exit when Accipiter hawks/merlins are attacking. Those are the main reasons I use round holes and there is another one. I WANT to use them on my private property. It is my choice and fortunately I live in the USA and not China, Cuba or North Korea.
We use all srehs in our satellite martin colonies because we can't monitor them and they are located in urban/suburban areas which have large starling populations. We use srehs because they are necessary in these areas.
Contrary to what you say, there is place for round holes and srehs in purple martin colonies. There are thousands of excellent landlords in both camps all over this country. I respect all these landlords and am grateful they are erecting housing for martins. I am not a "holist" and don't judge a martin landlord by the shape of the entrance hole he/she uses. I look at the quality of the housing, location, number of pairs, number of young fledged and the care the landlord gives to the martins. The shape of the entrance is irrelevant for landlords who manage their colonies well and can control any starling problem.
Steve
There is absolutely nothing wrong with using round holes if you don't have a starling problem or you can control it. We have a minor starling problem around our two personal martin colonies and I easily control it with shooting/trapping. I shot a whopping 3 starlings this season and none even landed on our martin housing.
The martins in our two colonies prefer round holes, are never entrapped in them, and the martin can easily enter/exit when Accipiter hawks/merlins are attacking. Those are the main reasons I use round holes and there is another one. I WANT to use them on my private property. It is my choice and fortunately I live in the USA and not China, Cuba or North Korea.
We use all srehs in our satellite martin colonies because we can't monitor them and they are located in urban/suburban areas which have large starling populations. We use srehs because they are necessary in these areas.
Contrary to what you say, there is place for round holes and srehs in purple martin colonies. There are thousands of excellent landlords in both camps all over this country. I respect all these landlords and am grateful they are erecting housing for martins. I am not a "holist" and don't judge a martin landlord by the shape of the entrance hole he/she uses. I look at the quality of the housing, location, number of pairs, number of young fledged and the care the landlord gives to the martins. The shape of the entrance is irrelevant for landlords who manage their colonies well and can control any starling problem.
Steve
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Guest
Not everyone has starlings and sparrows. The site we finally got setup this year has martins, round holes, and no starling or sparrow has ever been seen on the property ever. Keep in mind the martin house and two gourds below it has been sitting in the same spot for 4 years up all year/years long. Rural and full of thick woods no pastures. We finally got two pair this year by adding 12 gourds on the end of a dock on a small pond.
Now if there has been no sparrows or starlings in 4 years why worry now? If starlings do show up then the entrances can be switched
Now if there has been no sparrows or starlings in 4 years why worry now? If starlings do show up then the entrances can be switched
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Guest
Here Here I agree with you Steve. I have used the crescents and WDC entances and they do work and would use them on satellite colonies. However I also use round holes for some of the same reasons you do. Also I enjoy watching my martins and I know that they go in and out of a round hole more than they do on my excluder type entrances, so it must be easier for them, also a little quicker I believe. I have lost more birds to hawks than I have starlings, because I have lost 0 to starlings in nine seasons. That being said I would recommend srehs to most new landlords because of the lack of knowledge just starting out in how much time it takes to manage a colony properly.
No need to get riled up there Steve. Not sure why you are taking my post so personal. I don't think I said anything about you in my original post?? You are correct, it is YOUR choice. We both live in Amercia, which for the moment is still a free country. I have as much right to post a PRO SREH thread as you have to post the articles that you post. Have you ever tried a porched 2nd gen SREH at your personal colony to compare to the round hole or are you comparing to what your neighbor used, unporched crescents? By the way, I am not stupid, inferior and I don't follow the herd, and I didn't say you were either. It was my decision to use SREH. A very logical decision for me. I could not have a Martin colony without them. I will always promote them, they are the safer choice in most areas of our country. Look at the density of Starlings on the distribution map from Cornell. There are not many Starling free areas in this country.
I have plenty of hawks around here too. Coopers and Sharp Shins. My adult Martins don't get taken by them trying to enter the gourds. Come to think of it, when a hawk is spotted here, the Martins all take to the air. I don't think I have ever seen one retreat to a gourd.
I have 3" tunnels on all my gourds. I have never had a single case of wing entrapment at my colony. I know plenty of people who have never had any at their colony either. I don't have as many Martins as you have, but I do have a good sized colony, so my wing entrapment sample size over the past 7 years is plenty adequate to suite me.
I have plenty of hawks around here too. Coopers and Sharp Shins. My adult Martins don't get taken by them trying to enter the gourds. Come to think of it, when a hawk is spotted here, the Martins all take to the air. I don't think I have ever seen one retreat to a gourd.
I have 3" tunnels on all my gourds. I have never had a single case of wing entrapment at my colony. I know plenty of people who have never had any at their colony either. I don't have as many Martins as you have, but I do have a good sized colony, so my wing entrapment sample size over the past 7 years is plenty adequate to suite me.
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Scott D.- La
- Posts: 823
- Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:35 am
- Location: Louisiana
Brad
My first reply would be........ It's NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS WHAT I USE OR DO IN MY YARD.\
SECOND, I invite you to come on down and see for yourself the Starling threat here, which is nothing. Broad based assumption's.... no/no
Third, I have lost 10 or more Martins to SREH wing entrapment, while no Starling has ever harmed one feather of one Martin or egg. I am very fortunate if I get to murder 6 of them in a season and yes, I can shoot quite well..... Thank You. I could easily proclaim that SREH are NOT safe and why I am working on guards to stop wing entrapment. I can also state that some Martins get caught by Hawks because they cannot get through the SREH as fast as a round hole and have witnessed it several times first hand and the main reason I am not 100 % SREH not to mention the modifying and expense I would have to do because of a occasional Starling.
Fourth, this is a voluntary hobby, no paycheck for the hard work, no fame, no fortune. You/we should all be thankful when someone takes their time and money and invest in this hobby. We make suggestions, give advice, but you go with this attitude and your most likely to really turn potential landlords off. I have no problem using SREH, my birds use them fine even highly restrictive ones like the Dually. Even If I were 100% SREH, I still do not have the right tell someone what, and how to run their colony or what equipment they should use. It's theirs, they spent the time and money and own it. I have no right to tell them they have to use predator guards, no matter if it's crawling with snakes, supplemental feed even if they are dying one after another. They have the right to let nature take it's course, what gourd or entrance to use. If they want a 4 inch square hole, that's their business. Worry about your own, make it bigger if you want more colony to dictate.
Fifth and Final, why stop at SREH. Lets call everyone unfit for using Heath, S&K, TRIO, CUE or any other peice of equipment that does not have the Martin police stamp of approval. Lets say you can't host Martins unless you do it just like Brad Biddle does it and say's it's supposed to be done. Sound ridiculous, yes, just like a thread like this...... USELESS!
Edited: for less drama and comments the author found of a personal nature and not my intention to make any comment that someone would take personal.
My first reply would be........ It's NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS WHAT I USE OR DO IN MY YARD.\
SECOND, I invite you to come on down and see for yourself the Starling threat here, which is nothing. Broad based assumption's.... no/no
Third, I have lost 10 or more Martins to SREH wing entrapment, while no Starling has ever harmed one feather of one Martin or egg. I am very fortunate if I get to murder 6 of them in a season and yes, I can shoot quite well..... Thank You. I could easily proclaim that SREH are NOT safe and why I am working on guards to stop wing entrapment. I can also state that some Martins get caught by Hawks because they cannot get through the SREH as fast as a round hole and have witnessed it several times first hand and the main reason I am not 100 % SREH not to mention the modifying and expense I would have to do because of a occasional Starling.
Fourth, this is a voluntary hobby, no paycheck for the hard work, no fame, no fortune. You/we should all be thankful when someone takes their time and money and invest in this hobby. We make suggestions, give advice, but you go with this attitude and your most likely to really turn potential landlords off. I have no problem using SREH, my birds use them fine even highly restrictive ones like the Dually. Even If I were 100% SREH, I still do not have the right tell someone what, and how to run their colony or what equipment they should use. It's theirs, they spent the time and money and own it. I have no right to tell them they have to use predator guards, no matter if it's crawling with snakes, supplemental feed even if they are dying one after another. They have the right to let nature take it's course, what gourd or entrance to use. If they want a 4 inch square hole, that's their business. Worry about your own, make it bigger if you want more colony to dictate.
Fifth and Final, why stop at SREH. Lets call everyone unfit for using Heath, S&K, TRIO, CUE or any other peice of equipment that does not have the Martin police stamp of approval. Lets say you can't host Martins unless you do it just like Brad Biddle does it and say's it's supposed to be done. Sound ridiculous, yes, just like a thread like this...... USELESS!
Edited: for less drama and comments the author found of a personal nature and not my intention to make any comment that someone would take personal.
Last edited by Scott D.- La on Sat May 22, 2010 10:30 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Stephen Thomas
- Posts: 359
- Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2003 8:24 am
- Location: LeRoy/IL
I am a new land lord I think. Since they been here 8 days straight. And the female was putting in nesting material. I have a mixture so they can choose between: Round, Crescent, WDC, and Obround. The pair that has been here for 8 days choose a Crescent. I will replace the round hole with some thing else. Probably with a tunnel. Yes I do have starlings around and have battled to keep them out of any hole. I have had a starling actually make a hole bigger by pecking at the hole till he got it large enough to get in. I will install WDC or tunnels made with pvc pipe or other material so they can't destroy any of my natural gourds. I agree with the rest of the people that the round holes have there place. I also will not use any more round holes because starlings are a problem around here. Even if I do destroy some.
Steve Thomas (LeRoy,Il) trying since 2003, visitors 2006 & 2007 had 1 visitor.
2009 had 6 visitors, 3ASY & 3females(1 male serious)
2010 1ASY male & 1ASYfemale, May 9, 2010 I became a landlord
2011 They came back. Got cold .they left. Never came back. starting over.
2012 1 came by. 2013 (0)
2009 had 6 visitors, 3ASY & 3females(1 male serious)
2010 1ASY male & 1ASYfemale, May 9, 2010 I became a landlord
2011 They came back. Got cold .they left. Never came back. starting over.
2012 1 came by. 2013 (0)
It's funny how some of you get so riled up and tell me this is a free country and you can do what you want, and you are hammering me for posting something on a public forum. I believe my rights to free speach are as American as your right to put up a Martin house with a round hole.
Scott. First off, I don't drink. Not a drop. I'm not bored, and I didn't say you HAD to do anything, and no I really don't lack for attention. Happily married, got two great kids. Got all the attention I need. And Hoss you can stop with the personal attacks, and I don't take kindly to threats. If you want to cuss, or curse whatever you call it in Louisiana then do it, don't use the symbols or abbreviations.
Scott. First off, I don't drink. Not a drop. I'm not bored, and I didn't say you HAD to do anything, and no I really don't lack for attention. Happily married, got two great kids. Got all the attention I need. And Hoss you can stop with the personal attacks, and I don't take kindly to threats. If you want to cuss, or curse whatever you call it in Louisiana then do it, don't use the symbols or abbreviations.
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Scott D.- La
- Posts: 823
- Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:35 am
- Location: Louisiana
deleted.
Last edited by Scott D.- La on Sat May 22, 2010 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
Scott, sorry. I am absolutely not looking for an arguement. I don't think what I posted was funny, I think it's dead serious. I don't come on this forum as much as I use to. When I do visit, I post. You can go back and look through my profile and see how often I post since you obviously don't believe a word I'm saying, and I'm not sure why. I have never lied to you, anyone on this forum, or any other forum as far as I know. I AM NOT looking for an argument. Discussion, yes. I am simply stating my opinion, and it hasn't changed since I started the thread. I visit this forum when the Clubhouse is slow or when I am not sleepy enough to go to bed.
There are a lot of new people who start out reading posts on this forum. I wrote, what I wrote, because I believe what I wrote. Every person I have been a mentor for has heard the same spill from me. They all started out with SREH. I think everyone that starts a new colony should start with SREH. If you want to use round holes, then use them. I don't care what you use. I don't know who got kicked off here, or why they did. You can accuse me of playing dumb, but in this instance I'm just completely uninformed. Call it dumb if you like. I am not affiliated with the PMCA in any way shape or form, never have been nor am I privy to who get's banned from the forum or why. I haven't even renewed my PMCA membership that expired over a year ago. I do like their organization. Until Martin season got really going I couldn't even tell you the last time I was on this website.
I guess when you try to drive me in the ground through your whole response then I take it as a personal attack. Just so you'll know, I don't like Heath houses as the come from the factory, Trio houses are nice and can easily be modified. I have S&K cleanout ports on most of my gourds, and I think CUE makes some of the best products on the market. Maybe the Martin NAZI's, as you put it, won't come get me. If the PMCA bans me from the website for voicing my opinion, then so be it. My purpose has not been to cause them, you or anyone else grief, only to voice my opinion about what I consider to be a very important topic for new landlords.
There are a lot of new people who start out reading posts on this forum. I wrote, what I wrote, because I believe what I wrote. Every person I have been a mentor for has heard the same spill from me. They all started out with SREH. I think everyone that starts a new colony should start with SREH. If you want to use round holes, then use them. I don't care what you use. I don't know who got kicked off here, or why they did. You can accuse me of playing dumb, but in this instance I'm just completely uninformed. Call it dumb if you like. I am not affiliated with the PMCA in any way shape or form, never have been nor am I privy to who get's banned from the forum or why. I haven't even renewed my PMCA membership that expired over a year ago. I do like their organization. Until Martin season got really going I couldn't even tell you the last time I was on this website.
I guess when you try to drive me in the ground through your whole response then I take it as a personal attack. Just so you'll know, I don't like Heath houses as the come from the factory, Trio houses are nice and can easily be modified. I have S&K cleanout ports on most of my gourds, and I think CUE makes some of the best products on the market. Maybe the Martin NAZI's, as you put it, won't come get me. If the PMCA bans me from the website for voicing my opinion, then so be it. My purpose has not been to cause them, you or anyone else grief, only to voice my opinion about what I consider to be a very important topic for new landlords.
Last edited by Brad-AL on Sat May 22, 2010 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Scott D.- La
- Posts: 823
- Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:35 am
- Location: Louisiana
Brad, I edited my original post so you would not take it personal as they were not meant to be. My problem..... When I or Steve say we hardly ever have any Starlings issues..... we mean it. It makes me feel like your calling me a liar when you say "they" are putting out excuses. I have no problem with safe SREH and I think I can say, I have this wing entrapment problem finally whipped. I work very hard to have the success I have because of Hawks and sometimes have to monitor from daylight to dark..... no bull. I took your post as a deliberate attempt at a argument and hey, I will argue with the best of them, it's my nature 
If it were worded different, maybe it would not appear so accusing. I am about 75% SREH anyway so have no problem using them but would not be afraid to use round as I just don't have hardly any Starlings at all. If I did, I would certainly go 100% SREH without hesitation especially with my new guards that are working perfectly.
If it were worded different, maybe it would not appear so accusing. I am about 75% SREH anyway so have no problem using them but would not be afraid to use round as I just don't have hardly any Starlings at all. If I did, I would certainly go 100% SREH without hesitation especially with my new guards that are working perfectly.-
Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
Without arguing any or replying any more, I am in total agreement with
Brad that if you ever see a starling, then you will be much better off with the SREH. You can get upset, call me whatever symbols you can think of, but I will not reply to you about this. I think that he is right on...I absolutely see no valid reason whatsoever for a round hole even if only a few starlings are present. I started with round holes, but I got a divorce from them..I am one of the oldtimers in the martin business, but I always was willing to try new ideas and to drop old bad ideas
The round holes never helped the martins when a hawk attacked at our place. The martins flew away from the housing, they never did head for the gourds after they saw the hawk. I have seen owls pick off a martin late in the day as they were peeking into the gourds, but the martins never saw the owl coming. I have seen the hawks catch the martins in midair, but have not seen a hawk catch a martin that could not enter a gourd quick enough
I have not had wing entrapment either with round holes or with SREH, so I can't comment on that. It may be due to the large number of 3in tunnels that I use. I don't remember hearing of anyone having wing entrapment when they used a 3in tunnel.
Brad that if you ever see a starling, then you will be much better off with the SREH. You can get upset, call me whatever symbols you can think of, but I will not reply to you about this. I think that he is right on...I absolutely see no valid reason whatsoever for a round hole even if only a few starlings are present. I started with round holes, but I got a divorce from them..I am one of the oldtimers in the martin business, but I always was willing to try new ideas and to drop old bad ideas
The round holes never helped the martins when a hawk attacked at our place. The martins flew away from the housing, they never did head for the gourds after they saw the hawk. I have seen owls pick off a martin late in the day as they were peeking into the gourds, but the martins never saw the owl coming. I have seen the hawks catch the martins in midair, but have not seen a hawk catch a martin that could not enter a gourd quick enough
I have not had wing entrapment either with round holes or with SREH, so I can't comment on that. It may be due to the large number of 3in tunnels that I use. I don't remember hearing of anyone having wing entrapment when they used a 3in tunnel.
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
I Suppose we will never settle this debate, and so I will not even try to 
I will say that I have tried it both ways. I was a long time round hole martin man who went to all sreh. I don't know who has starling problems and who doesn't other than what they post and I certainly won't dispute their word on it.
However, I can say that I had starling problems every where I lived and tried to host martins. I have been all sreh for a good many years now I use all sreh with tunnels and am completely satisfied with the results and will never go back to the old way I did them.
And yes, I have had a couple hundred pairs for a few years now so I also know at least a little about martins and have watched a few martins over the years.....smile...
I make no claim to know everything about anything
especially about martins.
Having tried it both ways, I think I will agree with Brad and Emil. For me....tunnels with sreh are Far superior to round holes in every way.
And in the famous words of Forrest Gump....that's all I have to say about that
I will say that I have tried it both ways. I was a long time round hole martin man who went to all sreh. I don't know who has starling problems and who doesn't other than what they post and I certainly won't dispute their word on it. However, I can say that I had starling problems every where I lived and tried to host martins. I have been all sreh for a good many years now I use all sreh with tunnels and am completely satisfied with the results and will never go back to the old way I did them.
And yes, I have had a couple hundred pairs for a few years now so I also know at least a little about martins and have watched a few martins over the years.....smile...
I make no claim to know everything about anything
especially about martins. Having tried it both ways, I think I will agree with Brad and Emil. For me....tunnels with sreh are Far superior to round holes in every way.
And in the famous words of Forrest Gump....that's all I have to say about that
T. Seber
I agree ALL Purple Martin Houses should come with SREH's, if you die heart round holer's want them them cut them out and make them round.
I don't think I way off base saying the majority of PM's would benefit from srehs. Think were we would be without them. Most housing up is not monitored 24 seven and most us landlords that know better do still have to work.
This has been brought up before and the same old mine sets still dominate the decession. Majority of PM housing manufacturing companies are not going to change anything that costs them money knowing the initial buyer doesn't have a clue till starlings invade there colony if they are lucky enough to get one. There is only one manufacture that will listen and take chances on design changes. Why can't we just do what's right for the birds. No PM should suffer a grueling fight or death to starlings if it can be avoided 99.% of the time.
So IMO we as landlords SHOULD promote SREHS rather than keep faith with relic's of the pass! Oops did I say that again!
We can argue over which is better gourds or houses, but IMO srehs there should be NO disagreements. I don't care how big your colony is or how many pairs you got. It's not about you or me is about the protecting the birds we love.
the round hole is relic of the pass just like a 6x6x6 compartment. Geez have we learnt anything?
I got add So do you think that wing entrapments kill more PMs that starlings? And majority of sites in this country don't have starlings in the area? IMO I don't see how you can believe that when the majority of posts on any bird forum are about Starling invasions and how you can come to the conclusion that round holes are better for PMs.
I also would like to know which are more populated Hawks and owls or starlings?
I don't think I way off base saying the majority of PM's would benefit from srehs. Think were we would be without them. Most housing up is not monitored 24 seven and most us landlords that know better do still have to work.
This has been brought up before and the same old mine sets still dominate the decession. Majority of PM housing manufacturing companies are not going to change anything that costs them money knowing the initial buyer doesn't have a clue till starlings invade there colony if they are lucky enough to get one. There is only one manufacture that will listen and take chances on design changes. Why can't we just do what's right for the birds. No PM should suffer a grueling fight or death to starlings if it can be avoided 99.% of the time.
So IMO we as landlords SHOULD promote SREHS rather than keep faith with relic's of the pass! Oops did I say that again!
We can argue over which is better gourds or houses, but IMO srehs there should be NO disagreements. I don't care how big your colony is or how many pairs you got. It's not about you or me is about the protecting the birds we love.
the round hole is relic of the pass just like a 6x6x6 compartment. Geez have we learnt anything?
I got add So do you think that wing entrapments kill more PMs that starlings? And majority of sites in this country don't have starlings in the area? IMO I don't see how you can believe that when the majority of posts on any bird forum are about Starling invasions and how you can come to the conclusion that round holes are better for PMs.
I also would like to know which are more populated Hawks and owls or starlings?
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Steven Spencer
- Posts: 118
- Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 10:53 am
- Location: Jasper. Texas
1. It is easier for me to cut a 2" hole with my hole drill bit versus the exact dimensions for a sreh.
2. I maybe see a dozen starlings in a season and I really enjoy playing sniper and eliminating them, as opposed to allowing them to compete with other native birds.
With that being said, Brad, I agree that most people should have them, especially if you cannot monitor things closely like I can or in areas that have a higher density of starlings.
2. I maybe see a dozen starlings in a season and I really enjoy playing sniper and eliminating them, as opposed to allowing them to compete with other native birds.
With that being said, Brad, I agree that most people should have them, especially if you cannot monitor things closely like I can or in areas that have a higher density of starlings.
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Scott D.- La
- Posts: 823
- Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:35 am
- Location: Louisiana
If you want to see round holes gone, then you need to take this argument to the manufacturer's who make the money, set the standard's and sells this stuff. That's where this can be dictated. Everyone should call these businesses and demand they quite making round hole equipment, it's just that simple. If they refuse, then mount a campaign to blockade there businesses on these forum's.
RC, I assume your question is directed at me. I don't think anything outside my personal colony and do not make broad based assumptions of Anything going on Anywhere outside my personal colony. That is the difference between me and others who assume everything is the same at every location in the entire UNITED STATES of AMERICA. SREH and Wing Entrapment has in fact killed Martins at MY SITE, where no Starling has ever so much even pecked a egg. That is a FACT that has occurred at MY SITE. AT MY SITE, HAWKS do indeed outnumber Starlings and would be thrilled if I could trade for it's legal to kill Starlings. I have seen 6 Starlings for the year of 2010, 6 died here and have not seen anymore Starling's since late Febuary early March. I am sorry if these facts annoy anyone but that is the way it is, I can't change it!
RC, I assume your question is directed at me. I don't think anything outside my personal colony and do not make broad based assumptions of Anything going on Anywhere outside my personal colony. That is the difference between me and others who assume everything is the same at every location in the entire UNITED STATES of AMERICA. SREH and Wing Entrapment has in fact killed Martins at MY SITE, where no Starling has ever so much even pecked a egg. That is a FACT that has occurred at MY SITE. AT MY SITE, HAWKS do indeed outnumber Starlings and would be thrilled if I could trade for it's legal to kill Starlings. I have seen 6 Starlings for the year of 2010, 6 died here and have not seen anymore Starling's since late Febuary early March. I am sorry if these facts annoy anyone but that is the way it is, I can't change it!
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1 Ron Vasser
- Posts: 584
- Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:26 pm
- Location: Georgia/Rome
Brad, I don’t know why your question would warrant all the chesty replies you received but if I used round holes where I live I’d have to pull guard duty from daylight to dark and I got enough of that in the army. I agree with you and Emil, a little starling problem is still a problem. I recommend this site to children that are interested in martins and don’t know why I’d need to explain NFW to them.
Ron
Again, were not talking you or me. Do you actually think you are in the majority with no starling problems? IMO it whats good for PM protection overall. I also would rather use round holes (no I wouldn't they do more than just protect against starlings), but with the increasing starling populations and round hole are NOT deterring that count or possible at my area which I think I am in the same as the majority of the country. I can IMO say thats NOT a broad statement but rather facts.
Take it to the manufactures? Yea right! as long as they are making money and can cherry pick posts on this topic they are not likely to change for another 40 years.
Take it to the manufactures? Yea right! as long as they are making money and can cherry pick posts on this topic they are not likely to change for another 40 years.