All right - am trying to get a colony re-established in a new site that isn't ideal (trees about 25 ft away and winged predators everywhere).
Have been playing the dawn song diligently and yesterday and this morning finally have some visitors! Yippee!! The problem is they just can't seem to figure out the SREH entrances on my gourds - excluders and crescents. (I also have a mofified Trio with crescent doors and a green company-manufactured owl guard.)
I know this comes up every season so bear with me. Am getting nervous that I will not have any takers as I don't have round hole entrances. If you were me, would you go ahead and switch them out to round holes? I can replace the Trio doors and most of my gourds have the S&K ultimate tunnel so I could switch those over too.
Figure the Trio with the owl guard and round holes may not look appealing to starlings (can they even get through the smallish openings of the owl guard?) and I'd have to take my chances with the round-holed gourds. I just don't want to miss my window of getting the PM's to stay at my new place.
Ahh - am really struggling. What would you do fellow forum members??
I know this comes up every season......
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Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
Its most likely the trees. We have a large super colony, and my neighbors that live less than a block from me cannot get martins to stay at their place because the trees are about 25ft from their houses. There are plenty martins that look at their houses, but none stay. They would rather have trees than martins. Round holes may appear to help, and they may, but the type of entrance is probably not the reason for martins not staying at your place.
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
Come on guys, I can't cut down the trees. It's just not feasible. Besides you and I know that martins will stay in less than ideal conditions. We've seen houses 6 feet off the ground with sparrow nests and trees basically right next to them that are housing martins so please, let's leave that point out.
Should I switch to round holes and then switch back wehn established or am I being too nervous at this point my SREH's?
Should I switch to round holes and then switch back wehn established or am I being too nervous at this point my SREH's?
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LISA
LISA
Lizlou,
Once you get established, and you will, you can use the restrictor holes. Right now no way would I use them. Why make it difficult for them to even get into the compartments, much less nest there. The trees may not be helping, but I'd sure go round before attacking the trees. As far as pest and predators go, yes you'll have to contend with them, and hopefully you will and can, but we're trying to get a colony started first and foremost. Right? It sounds like to me that you're right on the verge of getting those birds. Don't fool around-----Go round. The very best of luck to you.
Once you get established, and you will, you can use the restrictor holes. Right now no way would I use them. Why make it difficult for them to even get into the compartments, much less nest there. The trees may not be helping, but I'd sure go round before attacking the trees. As far as pest and predators go, yes you'll have to contend with them, and hopefully you will and can, but we're trying to get a colony started first and foremost. Right? It sounds like to me that you're right on the verge of getting those birds. Don't fool around-----Go round. The very best of luck to you.
Hi Lislou.
My recommendation, would be to convert your Trio back to some round hole compartments, and, convert those compartments back to the factory, 6"X6" size.
This way you'll have some round holes to provide, but they'll be on the smaller, much less starling-attractive compartments.
Many folks that have started colonies with all, starling resistant entrances.
However,
There are also folks that have tried unsuccessfully for years to attract Martins, and are looking for as many options as possible, to attract that first pair. For some, that one option that made the difference, was offering a round hole, or two.
Round holes on cavities larger than 6"X6", that can quickly be converted to a starling resistant entrance, once a pair has committed, are especially useful.
My recommendation, would be to convert your Trio back to some round hole compartments, and, convert those compartments back to the factory, 6"X6" size.
This way you'll have some round holes to provide, but they'll be on the smaller, much less starling-attractive compartments.
Many folks that have started colonies with all, starling resistant entrances.
However,
There are also folks that have tried unsuccessfully for years to attract Martins, and are looking for as many options as possible, to attract that first pair. For some, that one option that made the difference, was offering a round hole, or two.
Round holes on cavities larger than 6"X6", that can quickly be converted to a starling resistant entrance, once a pair has committed, are especially useful.
Last edited by Matt F. on Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:46 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Bob Buskas
- Posts: 600
- Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 8:08 pm
- Location: Wetaskiwin Alberta, Canada
I would suggest to leave the SREH on, the Martins you are getting at this time of year are old birds that are just visiting from other sites. You are drawing them in with the Dawn song and your new housing makes them curious. In a week or two or maybe 3, younger birds will arrive and they will enter the SREH easily. When they want in, they will go in.
However, if you decide to convert a few back to round for now, Matts suggestion is a good one to reduce the compartment size temporarily to 6x6. Also you say you have lots of areal predators around, remember the Dawn song will attract them in as well, so turn it off when you get a few Martins coming in.
Good Luck!
However, if you decide to convert a few back to round for now, Matts suggestion is a good one to reduce the compartment size temporarily to 6x6. Also you say you have lots of areal predators around, remember the Dawn song will attract them in as well, so turn it off when you get a few Martins coming in.
Good Luck!
Bob Buskas, Alberta, Canada (The Northern Sky's Colony) Supplimental feeding is the key during bad weather, but you must train them to feed ahead of time.
OK - here's an update -- the male has figured out the SREH's on the gourd but the female doesn't seem to want to even try to enter and I know the female is the one that has to approve the site. Is this female skittish/nervous you think
because that's just the way the females are? I imgaine it's pretty normal for the male to be the go-getter and the female will come around when she's comfortable, correct?
Seeing the male figure out the SREH's has given me the confidence to keep those entrances on both the gourds and the Trio but am going to lower the owl guard on the Trio until I have committed birds, then I'll secure it in place to protect them.
I just might have a colony my first year in Kansas. Yippee! :-)
because that's just the way the females are? I imgaine it's pretty normal for the male to be the go-getter and the female will come around when she's comfortable, correct?
Seeing the male figure out the SREH's has given me the confidence to keep those entrances on both the gourds and the Trio but am going to lower the owl guard on the Trio until I have committed birds, then I'll secure it in place to protect them.
I just might have a colony my first year in Kansas. Yippee! :-)
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LISA
LISA
I think that's a great call. Once one of those little buggers figure out the entrances like your male Martin has, the others should definitely follow suit.Lislou wrote:Seeing the male figure out the SREH's has given me the confidence to keep those entrances on both the gourds and the Trio
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Chriscreole
- Posts: 781
- Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:31 am
- Location: Texas, Hutto
my housing gourds all started whit the SERH holes, once one figured it out the rest had it in a few trys. I'm one of those lucky ones who has between 25/30 martins the first year with several pairs. I think im in the migration path because they were staying on my outdoor patio ceiling fan blades last year, thats what got me started as landlord.
PMCA Member since 2010
Super System 24, All Troyer W/Conley 2 entrances.
Hi just wanted to say I have been torn about the round and sreh.I used round controlled the starlings and last year one got by killed some yound made me lose a sy. Pair.with out the sreh a starling will always end up geting by.so this year my 7 pair will come back to find them switched. But I left one round hole.a female showed up she just kept looking inside. And it was round soon as I made it outside she was looking in a crecent and when she decided to really tryed she pushed her self in.and I had a round hole.so seeing she done this leads me to think if they want in they will do it.it is hard when you get one just to look and fly away.it always brings up the question did I do the right thing its hard to get them and don't want them to leave. But me and you need to hang in their because its for their own good.hopefully the shape of a hole won't stop them.good luck to you.
]Hi just wanted to say I have been torn about the round and sreh.I used round controlled the starlings and last year one got by killed some yound made me lose a sy. Pair.with out the sreh a starling will always end up geting by.so this year my 7 pair will come back to find them switched. But I left one round hole.a female showed up she just kept looking inside. And it was round soon as I made it outside she was looking in a crecent and when she decided to really tryed she pushed her self in.and I had a round hole.so seeing she done this leads me to think if they want in they will do it.it is hard when you get one just to look and fly away.it always brings up the question did I do the right thing its hard to get them and don't want them to leave. But me and you need to hang in their because its for their own good.hopefully the shape of a hole won't stop them.good luck to you.[/quote]also if you really want round I have taped weed eater string to a round hole cover and when iv seen them I would run out pull it without haveing to lower anything to get them in the house.that way its not open till they come keeps bad birds out.
It seems, that when martins first get to a new site they will never just pop into a cavity without peeking in several times first. People with SREH anxiety mistake all that peeking in for not being able to get into the opening. In my opinion there is no reason for anyone to have round holes unless there are absolutely no starlings in the area or if they can monitor their colony much of the day all season. I started my colony with all ConleyII entrances and I know that no one within 25 miles were using that entrance. The martins use it with ease. There are still mostly round hole houses and gourds in my area but I am starting to see some crescents, modified excluders and conleys being used.
James
James
2009 One ASY pair 5 eggs 5 fledged 2010 2 pair 5 fledged 2011 8 pair 27 fledged 2012 14 pair 38 fledged
2013 20 pair 64 fledged 2014 19 pair fledged 84 2015 26 pair fledged 124 2016 36 pair fledged 156 2017 40 pair fledged 156
PMCA member
2013 20 pair 64 fledged 2014 19 pair fledged 84 2015 26 pair fledged 124 2016 36 pair fledged 156 2017 40 pair fledged 156
PMCA member
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flyin-lowe
- Posts: 3789
- Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 8:49 am
- Location: Indiana/Henry Co.
Like James said the females will usually not just hop right into a cavity. My first year it was a a day or so of sticking her head in and out checking compartments before they entered.
As for your earlier comment about poor sites attracting martins with housing 6 foot off the ground and infested with starlings. 99% of the time when you see a site like that it was not that way when the PM"s first started nesting there. I have seen sited locally with trees touching the housing a PM's everywhere. When the housing was put up the trees were much smaller and the sparrows weren't likely an issue. Once the PM's start a colony and nest for a couple years there site fidelity will be so strong that they will put up with trees, sparrows etc. Trying to start a colony in that situation is a different story. In my opinion if you don't get martins to stay the entrances are not the reason.
As for your earlier comment about poor sites attracting martins with housing 6 foot off the ground and infested with starlings. 99% of the time when you see a site like that it was not that way when the PM"s first started nesting there. I have seen sited locally with trees touching the housing a PM's everywhere. When the housing was put up the trees were much smaller and the sparrows weren't likely an issue. Once the PM's start a colony and nest for a couple years there site fidelity will be so strong that they will put up with trees, sparrows etc. Trying to start a colony in that situation is a different story. In my opinion if you don't get martins to stay the entrances are not the reason.
2026 HOSP 27
2025 62 pair HOSP 20
2024 60 pair, HOSP 44
2023 60+ pair, HOSP 8
2022 60 nests with 262 eggs, HOSP 14
2021 62 pair, HOSP 9
2020 42 nest, HOSP 8
2019- 31 pair
2018- 15 pair 49 fledged
2017 3 SY pair, 12 eggs , fledged 10. 4 additional lone SY's
2016 1 pair fledged 4
2015 Visitors
2014 Visitors
2013 Moved 6 miles, 1 pair fledged 2.
2012 30 pair fledged 100.
2011 12 pair 43 fledged.
2010 5 pair 14 fledged.
2025 62 pair HOSP 20
2024 60 pair, HOSP 44
2023 60+ pair, HOSP 8
2022 60 nests with 262 eggs, HOSP 14
2021 62 pair, HOSP 9
2020 42 nest, HOSP 8
2019- 31 pair
2018- 15 pair 49 fledged
2017 3 SY pair, 12 eggs , fledged 10. 4 additional lone SY's
2016 1 pair fledged 4
2015 Visitors
2014 Visitors
2013 Moved 6 miles, 1 pair fledged 2.
2012 30 pair fledged 100.
2011 12 pair 43 fledged.
2010 5 pair 14 fledged.
Appreciate all the advice.
I did have birds the night before last (two males were popping in and out of my BO-11's) but haven't seen any birds since.
I lowered the owl guard on the Trio and it's been a magnet for sparrows ever since. Found my sparrow trap door from 3 years ago and installed. Haven't caught one yet but I will. I don't intend for any HOSP to ruin my chances of attracting martins here and will trap and kill all that try and nest at my site.
If I don't have any takers this year (funny, I have blue bird boxes on either side of the yard and saw at least two male blue birds checking out my housing in late February bet no one decided to come back and nest) I will look at changing things next season.
Maybe my yard isn't as great a bird magnet as I thought it might be when we bought last spring. I knew it wasn't ideal but figured it wasn't horrible either. There is NO ONE around me offering large gourd cavities (never seen gourds at any site in Wichita for that matter) like I am so I thought that would go a long way in improving my chances.
I am still hopeful.
For those of you with birds, ENJOY!
I did have birds the night before last (two males were popping in and out of my BO-11's) but haven't seen any birds since.
I lowered the owl guard on the Trio and it's been a magnet for sparrows ever since. Found my sparrow trap door from 3 years ago and installed. Haven't caught one yet but I will. I don't intend for any HOSP to ruin my chances of attracting martins here and will trap and kill all that try and nest at my site.
If I don't have any takers this year (funny, I have blue bird boxes on either side of the yard and saw at least two male blue birds checking out my housing in late February bet no one decided to come back and nest) I will look at changing things next season.
Maybe my yard isn't as great a bird magnet as I thought it might be when we bought last spring. I knew it wasn't ideal but figured it wasn't horrible either. There is NO ONE around me offering large gourd cavities (never seen gourds at any site in Wichita for that matter) like I am so I thought that would go a long way in improving my chances.
I am still hopeful.
For those of you with birds, ENJOY!
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LISA
LISA
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dsonyay
- Posts: 1677
- Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:10 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Broussard
- Martin Colony History: 2010-2014 located in Slidell LA. Gourd rack with 16 gourds. Max of 2 pairs during this short period in Slidell. Plenty of fledglings.
2014-present.. moved to Broussard LA. Same Gourd Rack but added a 6 room house (modified from a 12 room)
2020: after a long drought of nothing, 4 pairs and 4 nests, 23 eggs total.
6 fledges.
2021: 9 pair, 47 eggs
36 hatchlings
30 fledged
2022: about 12 pairs.. many eggs, all fledged.. only had one hatchling die.. probably because of our schnauzer. :(
2023: 16 pairs. So far about 60 chicks with about a dozen eggs to go.
2024: 13 pair. About 60 eggs
2025: 14 pairs .. 69 eggs.
James-- I'm that personJamesinIA wrote:It seems, that when martins first get to a new site they will never just pop into a cavity without peeking in several times first. People with SREH anxiety mistake all that peeking in for not being able to get into the opening.James
I have a brand new site, 6 gourds w/SREH. I've had quite a few visits recently and I get them going halway in backing out and going to the next gourd and repeat, etc..I was getting to the point where I could swear they just aren't figuring the SREH out. I keep reading to be patient, but your explanation makes perfect sense. I'm sure they are very careful about just hopping into a gourd. These are wild animals worried about surviving and don't want to hop into a gourd they don't know.
I too will remain patient.
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dsonyay
- Posts: 1677
- Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:10 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Broussard
- Martin Colony History: 2010-2014 located in Slidell LA. Gourd rack with 16 gourds. Max of 2 pairs during this short period in Slidell. Plenty of fledglings.
2014-present.. moved to Broussard LA. Same Gourd Rack but added a 6 room house (modified from a 12 room)
2020: after a long drought of nothing, 4 pairs and 4 nests, 23 eggs total.
6 fledges.
2021: 9 pair, 47 eggs
36 hatchlings
30 fledged
2022: about 12 pairs.. many eggs, all fledged.. only had one hatchling die.. probably because of our schnauzer. :(
2023: 16 pairs. So far about 60 chicks with about a dozen eggs to go.
2024: 13 pair. About 60 eggs
2025: 14 pairs .. 69 eggs.
The other day we were working in Lafitte La and saw a martin house 4 feet- yes 4 feet --off the ground- and totally occupied by martins. Next to it at about 8 feet was another house. Amazing. In the Lafitte area there are many martin houses in backyards along the Bayou Barataria.flyin-lowe wrote:As for your earlier comment about poor sites attracting martins with housing 6 foot off the ground and infested with starlings.
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tonyg
- Posts: 1520
- Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 4:16 pm
- Location: Olpe, KS
- Martin Colony History: 22 year landlord, 14 at current residence..offering 9 racks and a homemade T-8 for 166 total cavities. 160 Pair in 2018 Racks consist of a Deluxe 12, AAA 16, Starburst 16, 2 K-18 Series, Super 24, 2 Gemini, Multi-purpose/two trio’s/4gourds and a T-8..Great hobby to be involved in..
Lisa, i've been a landlord here in Ks. for the last 14 yrs. I have always used round holed entrances,(cardinal sin to most landlords) but live in the country where I can control the sparrows and starlings.(20ga shotgun) I truly believe that they are attracted to the populated areas, so in my opinion i'd stay with the sreh in the residential area.....just curious to know why you chose a residential area instead of something with a wider open space knowing you wanted to get back into being a martin landlord? Good luck with your dilemma...Tony
22 year landlord..9 Rack Systems for 2018 and my home built T-8 for a total of 166 cavities..160 pair in 2018 ..SUPER COLONY!!! Love You Bev... Fan of those St. Louis Cardinals!!!!!
Just wanted to add that my female that came back april third that went in a sreh came back today.also I have 3asy males back.yesterday they just flew up peeked inside left.weather warmed up today and they have been here all day and they just went in.they came back to new holes when last year they had round.so I do believe when they want in they just go in like its nothing .and what a relief for me not to worry about starlings now when they land I don't go running clapping I just laugh.so its true what other have told me they can get in when ready its not at all hard for them.mine just sinced their was a change so they peeked in to check it out first.wish I done this years ago.good luck to you.
Tony - why did I settle and buy a house with trees in the backyard knowing it was not an ideal setting for martins? Two reasons: my son and my daughter.
Had to buy in a subdivision (managed by a dreaded HOA) in order for them to go where I wanted to send them for school.
Yes, I love martins but my kids come first.
Of course when we're retired it will be a different story. Already told my dear husband I'm not going willingly to Arizona as he would like to (he's a golfer and a desert rat) as I couldn't enjoy the birds. He just rolls his eyes but he's got to know I'm serious.
Dave - best of luck in attracting them this year! I've heard they're in LA in droves. Not the same here in the midwest. Bet you get PM's in no time. Rooting for you!
Chickadee - nice job on overcoming the SREH anxiety! Sounds like you are on your way to a successful season. Congrats.
My new plan of action is to have hubby raise the gourds 2 - 3 feet this weekend. Maybe then I'll have better luck with a female feeling comfortable enough to check out my gourds like the males did. I have a Tri-tel pole and with the KS winds felt comfortable with raising them to about 11 ft but now am re-considering. I can always lower them back down once they commit, right?
Hoping the extra height will help.
Had to buy in a subdivision (managed by a dreaded HOA) in order for them to go where I wanted to send them for school.
Yes, I love martins but my kids come first.
Of course when we're retired it will be a different story. Already told my dear husband I'm not going willingly to Arizona as he would like to (he's a golfer and a desert rat) as I couldn't enjoy the birds. He just rolls his eyes but he's got to know I'm serious.
Dave - best of luck in attracting them this year! I've heard they're in LA in droves. Not the same here in the midwest. Bet you get PM's in no time. Rooting for you!
Chickadee - nice job on overcoming the SREH anxiety! Sounds like you are on your way to a successful season. Congrats.
My new plan of action is to have hubby raise the gourds 2 - 3 feet this weekend. Maybe then I'll have better luck with a female feeling comfortable enough to check out my gourds like the males did. I have a Tri-tel pole and with the KS winds felt comfortable with raising them to about 11 ft but now am re-considering. I can always lower them back down once they commit, right?
Hoping the extra height will help.
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LISA
LISA