Steve K, anyone, question about predation.

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elyas
Posts: 140
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 8:29 am
Location: Meridianville/Alabama

As in previous post noticed Thursday night the decreased martin activity at the colony. 6 gourds were suppose to fledge this week and 8 a week after that. Lowered the housing this morning and only 4 gourds had babies left. The ones that emptied very early showed no signs of attack, ie no blood, no feathers, etc. I do weekly nest checks so the fledging dates are correct. Have been reading the archives and I'm afraid this landlord may have learned a lesson about snakes the hard way. Live in a subdivision and never have been concerned about snakes.

Even if the birds had fledged early (I've never seen this) they usually stay around for 7-14 days after fledging has taken place. Would I see any physical signs of a snake attack? If an owl attacks would feathers and blood be visible?

To say the least, guarding devices will be used in the future. The unfortunate consequence of this landlord learning the hard way is my martins had to suffer. I'm a heartbroken middle age man today.

Any ideas on what happened? :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
klcretired
Posts: 2174
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2003 3:06 am
Location: Grand Prairie,Tx

elyas,
I am truely sorry for your heartache & Loss...it's very fustrating for a PM Landlord to go thru this.I have been there myself and year's ago lost my whole colony and had to Buy new houseing w/ preditor Guard's ,all the bell's & Whistle's and start over ,It is very rewarding when things do go Right tho , Whatever you do please don't ever give up, I feel it could be either a snake or Owl or both, just because there's no sign's ,ie:blood or feather's doesn't mean that it's not an Owl especially if the PM's are not fully fledged the owl can take em and fly to the closest safe place and have lunch w/o any evidence of any struggle, as for as a snake goes well he's a really silent killer that usually goes undetected.Steve Kroenke has a real good article on making a Snake Guard useing 2 different size netting, if you email me i can send you the plans & info, also if you are able, you need PM houseing w/ deep Nest cavities if you don't already have the deep cavities or if you plan to buy in the future please be sure and get the Houseing w/Preditor Guards .Like me, you too will recover if you stay after it and help the Martins.
Pictures Taken with Canon Rebel XT Digital using a Sigma 50-500 Long Lens.

Wishing everyone a Great Martin Year
Happy Martining for 2022 to everyone,

K.C.

klcretired@tx.rr.com
Steve Kroenke
Posts: 4342
Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:49 pm
Location: Louisiana/Logansport

Hey Elyas,

First, this could have been a rat snake attack. Rat snakes are everywhere, including suburbia and even those gated communities! They are super abundant in the Deep South. Snakes leave no trace of their presence and will often eat the babies/adults and then depart. Some snakes will ?bed down? in a gourd/house compartment and you may see the nesting material pushed up and blocking the entrance hole. If the snake leaves, you will just find an empty nest. Sometimes rat snakes will kill an adult martin in the process after eating their young. A small snake may be unable to swallow the parent after eating a brood of babies. In this situation, you may find a dead adult martin with no physical wounds. I have found that in my housing before I had effective snake guards. Occasionally, the head of the martin will look wet and the feathers astray. The rat snake may have tried to swallow the martin head first and then ?spit? it out.

It probably was not an owl attack. Owls would have to reach deep inside the compartment to retrieve the young and this would usually result in the nesting material being pulled toward the entrance hole and perhaps some even pulled out some. The young often grip nesting material as the owl pulls them out. You may even see some blood smears near the entrance hole and feathers stuck to the blood around that area. Also owls typically take martins to the ground near the housing if the lawn is closely mowed. There the owl plucks the martin and leaves a pile of feathers.

Yes, these martins may have fledged early due to heat or perhaps parasites or the parents may have decided it was time. Parent martins don?t always bring their young back to roost in their nest after fledging. Most of mine do, but some do not. The parents take their fledglings away from the colony to possibly roost in trees and you never see them again though the parents may come back for some post nesting cavity defense behavior later. If the nest has a significant parasite infestation, then the parents probably would not bring their young back. Also, the fledglings could have been lost to predators or were not able to fly efficiently and may have been grounded away from your colony after leaving the nest. In these cases, the young, of course, would not return back to roost in the evenings.

Just keep a close eye on your colony in the evenings and see if the fledglings that ?disappeared? return with their parents to roost. If they do, then you know they fledged a little early. Also watch your remaining martins for any ?abnormal fright behavior?. Are the martins reluctant to roost in the housing in the evening? Do the parents seem nervous during the day? These types of behaviors can indicate an earlier predator attack.

Please install some kind of snake guard on your housing just to ensure one of the belly crawlers does not climb the pole. I have had great success with bird netting to create snake traps. These catch the rat snakes. Another excellent guard is a 6 or 8 inch diameter PVC pipe inserted over the bottom portion of housing pole. The pipe should be about 4 feet in length and firmly anchored to the ground to keep snakes from crawling underneath it. Place a snake net trap above the PVC pipe as an insurance policy.

Again, your martins may have fledged early and they are doing fine. Let?s hope so.

Steve
elyas
Posts: 140
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 8:29 am
Location: Meridianville/Alabama

Your kindness is greatly appreciated. Put up some plastic yesterday and put "snake be gone" around that. Did nest check yesterday and found no mites or other parasites. We can only hope that an early fledging took place and they did not return. Three gourds of babies left so maybe, with the help ya'll have given, these 3 will have no problem.

The colony will definitely be changed next year. As KLC says, " the bells and whistles" will be installed. If someone would have told me 25 years ago that I would care so much for a bird I'd called them crazy. I love these little amazing creatures.

Once again, thanks for response and the kindness.
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